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  Back to Chat Transcripts Food Matters: Carb Counting

Food Matters: Carb Counting from September 18, 2000
With Betty Brackenridge

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:46:32 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd at 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Good evening everyone. We'll start our "Food Matters" chat at 21:00 (9pm Eastern). See you then.

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:51:35 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
Hello everyone!!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:51:51 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd at 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Hi Beth ... we'll be starting in about 8 minutes.

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:52:35 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
Oh sorry Im early:-0

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:52:44 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
:-o

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:58:19 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Not to worry - me too

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:58:28 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd at 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Betty ... Welcome.

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:59:14 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Hi Jeff

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:59:52 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
I need a spiffier computer - slow response time oer here.

Mon Sep 18 2000 20:59:58 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd at 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Betty, I told the parents in the Parents room to head on over. We should see some more people showing up soon.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:00:36 Eastern US
Lisa from 152.163.204.211
hello

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:01:03 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
That's cool - or you and I could talk carbs to our hearts' content! LOL

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:01:07 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd at 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Betty, I've added a link to the "Carbs and Control" page at the head of the links (above). You can refer people to that.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:01:20 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Hi Lisa, Welcome

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:01:38 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Hi everyone

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:01:39 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
Hi Lisa and BettyB

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:01:47 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Thanks-that should be helpful to people with basic questions

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:02:07 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Hi beth - the earlybird

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:02:08 Eastern US
Lisa (Chapman 7 dx'd @ 2 1/2) from 152.163.204.211
Jeff parents are saying they can't find the food chat room.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:02:21 Eastern US
Lisa (Chapman 7 dx'd @ 2 1/2) from 152.163.204.211
All of them are in the parents room.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:02:23 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd at 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Our poll this week shows that 79% of people use carb counting!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:02:39 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
And BArb - thanks for signing in

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:02:52 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Hello:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:03:01 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
Hey atleast I wasnt late!!!:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:03:05 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
That because CWD and Diabetes123 users rule!! LOL

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:03:11 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Had to use the alternate log in..

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:03:25 Eastern US
Judy from NY from 24.161.8.110
aha! here I am

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:03:39 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
Hello kristy

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:03:40 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
The use is much lower overall, but growing thank goodness

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:03:52 Eastern US
Laura in Michigan (Sam's mom) from 63.20.15.196
Hey Betty! Wow, tough competition tonight against Olympic Men's gymnastics...

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:04:49 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
I'd pick carbs over men's gymnastics anyday..

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:04:49 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
It's a wonder anyone's here -- even mE!!! Thanks for coming!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:04:58 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
yea I wached that too,Laura

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:05:12 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
Hi all

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:05:15 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd at 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Well, I'm going to turn the room over to Betty Brackenridge for our first "Food Matters" chat -- this one about carbohydrate counting.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:05:28 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
well some of it!!!:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:05:31 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Sounds like you love carb counting Kristy - how long've you and Drew been using it?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:06:01 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
I am guessing that carb counting is rather new?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:06:18 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Thanks Jeff -- Welcome everbody -- This is the first of these Food Chats that will be taking place every Monday night

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:06:35 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Betty, we have carb counted since his dx in 1995..the most liberating way to manage the food issue..

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:06:50 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Carb counting isn't new exactly -- but was used by very few until the last few years

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:06:59 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
we started with exchanges many years ago, but carb counting is definitely easier

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:07:15 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Liberating is the word allright --

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:07:18 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
hhmm,,,maybe not so new *G*

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:07:44 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Judy -- how is carb counting better for you than exchanges?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:08:01 Eastern US
Laura in Michigan (Sam's mom) from 63.20.15.196
I don't know if this is your format, Betty... but I have a question right off the bat. Carb counting for Sam is different in the morning. For some reason, the bagel and juice he eats at 7:30 are "processed" differently than the same bagel and juice he might have at noon. What is going on in the morning that's different? We've been adding a unit of H to compensate (on the pump) because that's his favorite breakfast!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:08:45 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
i have read a lot this past year,,,,there does seem to be a group that think carb counting is horrible and the diet should be tighter--what is that correct diet?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:09:08 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Betty - even when Elissa was on exchanges, I did so many substitutions that it was almost like carb counting even before it was in vogue

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:09:09 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Laura there are a couple of things-- and is that MY laura??

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:09:23 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Meeting queen?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:09:23 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
My son's insulin needs are greater in the morning, Laura.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:10:00 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
For one thing, many people need MORE H per carb in the morning. This is due to levels of growth hormone and other hormones in the morning.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:10:09 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Carb counting works great for us, but I also have to consider glycemic index - some things cause Lawren to soar (Corn, white bread, potatoes). That's where I don't believe an exchange is an exchange is an exchange...

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:10:17 Eastern US
Laura in Michigan (Sam's mom) from 63.20.15.196
Yes, my dear. :-)
Your Sam, too.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:10:34 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
if you read posts at the insulin-pumers site, a very large number of people have a different insulin/carb ratio in the morning than the rest of the meals

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:10:51 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
For another, bagels are a "fast carb" for many people -- meaning that they are digested and absorbed more quivkly. This translates to needing more insulin johnny on the spot when you eat them

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:11:59 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
And you don't have to be a pumoper to need the higher ratio -- for example, a lot of people need IH per 15 grams at breakfast, but0= more like 1H for 15 later in the day

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:12:23 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
The specific numbers are an individual thing, of course.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:12:57 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
OOPS - mistyped -- meant to say 1 for 10 at breakfast and 1 for 15 later int he day!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:13:04 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Betty - you don't mean 1 unit per 10 gm in the morning?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:13:10 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
We tend to get higher levels by dinnertime than any other time of the day,,,no matter what she has eaten for breakfast, lunch, snack----hormones?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:13:31 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
Hello...So it is true that a carb is a carb no matter what the food is....some just take longer to be absorbed than others?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:14:02 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Barb - your comment about glycemic index is very true -- it's important to keep that in mind, but the specifics vary from person to person

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:14:37 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Yes, Kathy -we say "A Carb is A Carb... but they'renot all created equal."

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:14:39 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
I have a friend dxd 5 weeks ago and she is on a very stict meal plan she cant do any thing like exchanging a fruit for a carb. why didnt they give her any info on this? She is still in the honymoon stage and if you ask me I think this would be the best time to start on the cab counting any thoughts of why the did this meal plan to her? Ive herd of others being done this way to Why???

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:15:09 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
dinner time highs may mean that her morning background insulin is pooping out... does she take NPH in the morning?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:15:44 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
So I guess it's pretty much trial & error finding which foods to avoid depending on the person...

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:15:56 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
yes, she does take NPH in the morning,,along with H

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:16:12 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Beth -- it's a shame to hear what poor, outdated, or incomplete advice people often get at diagnosis. I'm with you. Anyone new to diabetes these days should be introduced to carb management

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:16:44 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Sue - does sarah get any lunchtime insulin?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:16:49 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
Any way of knowing how much each gram of carb will raise b/s level?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:17:08 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Barb, I don't think it's so much a m,atter of avoiding -- at least not if you're using Humalog to cover meals -- more like figuring out HOW to fit things in -- timing or dose of insulin may need to be adjusted to get optimal results

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:17:30 Eastern US
Mary-Regina (Mom of Patrick4,dx'd at 3.75 yrs) from 165.247.4.6
We have only been doing this"carbo Counting" for 9 weeks since Patrick was diagnosed, it seems like an awful lot of food for a little guy, i fruit and 2 starches at breakfast 3 starches 1 fruit and a protien at lunch, 3 starches a fruit and l protein. plus 3 2 starch snacks

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:17:42 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
No lunchtime insulin, Judy

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:17:57 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
and what else you consume with the carb will affect it's absorption rate. Is that right, betty?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:18:07 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Betty, would you be able to explain the 1800 rule..or the 1500 rule?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:18:17 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Sue - she may need a tad at lunch, then

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:18:19 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Sue, then she may be runninglow on her N around supper and need to use a higher Humalog to carb ratio at supper because there isn;t much N to back it up

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:18:57 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
She always is back to a decent level by her bedtime insulin,,,just concerned about that suppertime high

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:19:13 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.28.177
hi room!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:19:22 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Sue, I'm guessing maybe Sarah doesn't want to take a shot at school??

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:19:37 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
Hi Sharon..

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:19:56 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
we homeschool, Barb---so it doesn't matter

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:20:15 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Hi sharon

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:20:19 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
Every morning my blood is around 120-200 but at 10:00 I am always under 40!!! to day I was LO I get a5R 5H and 21L and I also have a carb snack At 9:30 Any suggestions?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:20:20 Eastern US
Susie (Type 2) from 207.29.207.192
Good evening.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:20:29 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Sue, maybe if you'd try a little more H per carb at supper and/or take the H a few minutes before the meal, it would help brin the post-supper into line

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:20:35 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
and she takes shots anywhere! right at the table at restuarants!!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:20:54 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
We are having problems with supper time highs too, Sue..I'm going to increase the a.m. NPH tomorrow...he does NOT want to take a shot at lunch...he does check his b/s before lunch, though...

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:21:02 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Hi Susie and Sharon - welcome

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:21:26 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
our endo doesn't like the sliding scale---so we slide carbs instead! LOL

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:21:55 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Kathy it may not be a matter of the amount of morning N- but just of the amount of time that's gone by -- probably not best to increase the morning N unless he's coming in to dinner on the high side too

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:22:28 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
He's OK at lunch, Betty....high at dinner..

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:22:53 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
we are also fighting hormones,,,so some days there isn't much we can do

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:23:19 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
oBetty, did you see my question about the 1800 rule/1500 rule? Do you think this would be a good forum to discuss that?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:23:29 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
I tried sliding carbs because it seemed easier to control, but Lawren was too young to continue that, she needs to eat when she's hungry to grow. We now do 4 shots a day on a Flex Management and love it - more control

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:23:40 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Beth, about that major low in the morning, it's a sign of having too much insulin around bwteen the meals --- why both 5 H AND 5R when you're also taking background N?? Any idea?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:23:42 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Beth - you cold try to have your snack earlier and maybe add more protein to it

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:24:23 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Beth - that's where you will like the pump - one type of insulin only - usually H

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:24:37 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Barb - you hit the nail on the head -- kids to eat what they need to eat -- diabetes management has to be fitted to that, NOT the other way around.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:25:05 Eastern US
Susie (Type 2) from 207.29.207.192
Betty, the dietician that set me up with my food regiment when dx'd always stressed that complex and simple carbs could be freely exchanged. Do you agree?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:25:05 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
Betty, Any way of knowing how much each gram of carb will raise levels of blood sugar?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:25:38 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Gee, Kristy - sorry - your question got lost in the shuffle!! what about the 1500/1800 rule?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:25:39 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
I tried just h and it didnt work as well by its self(but that was 2 years ago!!!)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:25:39 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Betty - do you recommend subtracting out fiber when adding up carb grams?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:26:10 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
lets see if i can keep a connection this time :-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:26:24 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
i have to admit that the sliding carbs does work for us---and if she is high,,she usually isn't that hungry

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:26:40 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Susie, 15 grans of carb from any type of food is going going to send the same amount of gluvose to the bloodstream -- so you can exchange these foods as you were advised

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:27:02 Eastern US
Beth (12 /starting on minimed pump in 2 months (here abouts)) from 64.30.68.32
I got to go thanks for the advise!!!:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:27:57 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Judy -- I only recommend subtracting grams of fiber if the blood sugars after eating show that it;s making a difference. Most people don't eat enough fiber for this to be an issue -- but if it is, then it is.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:28:57 Eastern US
Mary-Regina (Mom of Patrick4,dx'd at 3.75 yrs) from 165.247.4.6
Hi Betty This is my first time in this chat room, my son was diagnosed 9 weeks ago and he has a ton of food he has to eat. Any ideas for snacks that are 30 carbs that are "light" in that it is not a ton for him to eat?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:29:17 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Beth, just substituting H for R doesn;t work well and that may have been your problem when you tried it before. We use ONLY H for meal coverage at our center because it is the most like body insulin. And it definitely gives the most consistent results in the pump.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:29:30 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
the only food prob we have is this: steven, my 6 yr old, is the worst eater. prior to dx lived on steak & cheerios, so now food is an issue, and i am not happy about that. any suggestions?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:29:36 Eastern US
sue (ohio) (sarah 14 dx 9/99) from 166.62.34.218
hope to be back

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:29:45 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Kathy - There is a rule of 500 where you take 500 and divide that by the total daily dose of insulin = grams covered by humalog

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:29:50 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
Mary-Regina, I think those little snack puddings are around 25 or 30 carbs...

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:30:43 Eastern US
Wanda from 24.218.184.227
Hi, How's everyone?? I almost forgot about this "special chat"

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:30:49 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Mary-Regina, If your son is feeling burdened by the amount of food that's been prescribed, then I'd recommend going back for an adjustment. Your son needs the same amount of food now that he needed before he got diabetes -- it's just that now you need a way to keep it balanced with insulin.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:31:11 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
isnt 30 grams of carb alot for a little kid's snack? we dont count carbs, i am just wondering

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:31:55 Eastern US
Wanda from 24.218.184.227
Kaitlyn gets 30 grams of carbs for her afternoon snack.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:32:35 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Kathy, for ex. Lawren's total daily dose of insulin is 21. 500 divided by 21 = 23.8. Each unit of humalog covers about 24 grams of carbohydrate. Works for us!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:32:41 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
how old is kaitlyn, wanda?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:32:54 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Barb, that's similar to the Rule of 1800/1500 that Kristy mentioned eqrlier -- for insulin senstive people (most with type 1 diabetes) you divide the total daily insulin dose into 1800. This gives you the approximate drop in BG from 1 unit of H.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:32:59 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
Thanks, Barb...didn't know about the 500 rule..

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:33:08 Eastern US
Wanda (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
She is 6 1/2

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:33:43 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Hi folks.
I'm having what I believe to be a problem with my 10 year old son's appetite. I can't fill him. He'd eat 24/7 if I let him.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:33:48 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
ok, guess i have no clue since we dont count

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:33:58 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Example: Susie takes 30 units> 1800 divided by 30 = 60. So each unit of H will drop glucoxse about 60 points. One third of that number (20) is the carb coverage for 1 unit H.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:34:23 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Sue..my son also:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:34:30 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Sharon - you do food exchanges?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:34:32 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
sue, inhaling? the insulin? i wasnt aware that it was avail yet

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:34:50 Eastern US
Wanda (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Sharon..What method do your kids use?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:34:53 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
nope- my kids eat a regular diet. thats it

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:34:58 Eastern US
Mary-Regina (Mom of Patrick4,dx'd at 3.75 yrs) from 165.247.4.6
Yes, sharon, He has to have 3 such snacks like this per day, Now I take a blood sugar reading in the afternoon and if he is high I only give him one carb. Especially since his blood sugars are still all over the place

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:35:16 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Sue, what's Evan's overall control like?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:35:35 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
well, gabi eats a regular diet. steven eats nothing

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:35:36 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Both high and low blood sugars can make kids want to eat CHAIRS!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:35:37 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
sharon - how do you determine your insulin doses, then?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:35:45 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Hi Sue, CT - Lawren had that problem, too. GROWTH SPURT! We worked with her endo and had carbs added at every meal until she felt full.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:35:55 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Inhaling is still in the study phase. He's in a study group at Yale New Haven. We've been inhaling for one week now.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:36:23 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
my kids eat 3 meals (if i can get breakfast into them) and 3 snacks each day.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:36:35 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
I'd say Evan is in good control. But his eating gets out of hand. I worry about unnecessary weight gain.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:36:42 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
very cool sue. are his bg's the same inhaling?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:37:05 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
could be growth spurts about to start tho, couldnt it?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:37:08 Eastern US
Wanda (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Sharon..Do they see a dietitian (sp?)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:37:32 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Hi. Betty I just want you to know I recommend Sweet Kids to every parent of a newly diagnosed child. I think the book is excellent.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:38:09 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
we titrated until bg's were acceptable & thats it. kids numbers are great!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:38:24 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Well, if his blood sugars are more or less normal, it may just be normal appetite -- kids appetites ebb and flow, whether or not they have diabetes. it can be tough keeping up with it on the insulin side

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:38:50 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
yes, we saw 2 nutritionists, 1 affiliated with our endo & one not

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:38:55 Eastern US
Shelly (Canada) (son 4.5 (pumping 2 weeks)) from 205.200.28.77
Hi!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:39:06 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Ellen, Thanks so much for syig so. I'm proud of the book and still get a lot of notes from parents saying it's helpful.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:39:08 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
well, he usually spurts up when I notice him "paunching". but this latest paunch has hung on for too long. He's a big kid for his age. always in the 95 percentile or over - but always proportionate.
Control when inhaling has been a little tough to get evened out, I think we need a little more adjustment time.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:39:39 Eastern US
Shelly (Canada) (son 4.5 (pumping 2 weeks)) from 205.200.28.77
Are we talking carbs?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:40:19 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Hi everyone, I relly hope the inhaling process becomes available to us in the near future

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:40:25 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
For specific information on growth and appetite, you can refer to Sweet Kids. And I'd also Recommend "How to Get Your Kid To eat... But Not Too Much" by Ellyn Satter

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:40:30 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
really

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:40:37 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Yes, Shelly, we are

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:41:16 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Our biggest problem, Is breakfast, Kaitlyn hates eating early!!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:41:35 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
I still can't get into carb counting

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:41:41 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
i am concerned about the inhaling tho, how would it affect a child with asthma?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:42:05 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
My son is nearly 13, and he can eat nonstop some days and other days not be hungry. It works with the pump.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:42:10 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Well, Sue - if he stays on his growth curve at the 95th percentile (you married a linebacker, perhaps??) then I'd say he's doing fine -- just being himself

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:42:17 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
wanda. i give my kids a carnation instant breakfast shake. at least i feel there is some milk & vitamins in their bodies

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:42:26 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
I think carb counting becomes routine after a while:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:42:49 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Wanda is Kaitlin using Humalog for carb coverage?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:43:03 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Don't know how the inhaling would react w/ asthma. My GUESS is that it would not be compatible.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:43:06 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Sharon..I wonder how many carbs in that????

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:43:15 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
other days i make a shake with yogurt, milk & some oj. enough to get them thru the morning

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:43:29 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
gimme a second & i will look

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:43:37 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Yes, BettyB, Kaitlyn gets H at every meal, along with NPH at every meal

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:44:01 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
I'd agree, Wanda -- most folks have to go through a learning curve -- it's awkward at first, but then becomes second nature

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:44:16 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Lauraelana it takes about six months if you keep at it and eventually the carb counting comes naturally.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:44:48 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
It's my understanding that they excluded kids with respiratory difficulties from the clinical trials of inhaled insulin

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:44:54 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
chocolate & strawberry each have 28 carbs, not including the milk i add to it

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:44:55 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
The studies showed that the efficacy of the inhaled insulin is definitely based upon how deeply one inhales. I would imagine that a child with asthma would be the last to try it.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:45:16 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
then they have no idea how it will affect those children :-(

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:45:36 Eastern US
Steve (Allie - 14 - dx 6/97 pump 12/99) from 168.191.57.220
Hi all - had some problems connecting - i can't imagine anything but carb counting - i would think exchanges are quite inexact - especially with a little one where +/- 10g CHO is a really big deal - there's a lot of difference between a slice of bread that's 23 CHO - and counts for 2 exchanges - a sandwich means you're off by almost a full exchange (46 and it counts for 60)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:45:37 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Kaitlyn is just starting to read labels...It is to funny when a 6 year old, says....OOPS to many carbs, cant have that!!!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:45:42 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Lauraelana - have you seen the booklets by ada, Carb counting? It's a set of three and it explains it in a really easy to understand way.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:46:16 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
So, Wanda, maybe she could also switch to alighter breakfast that's a better match for her normal appetite

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:46:20 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Now I can't imagine trying to keep bgs under control without counting carbs

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:46:30 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
i guess that would make it difficult for young children as well, they cant possibly always inhale with all their might

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:46:41 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
We went to a dietitian at the beginning but now I just go by how her level goes.. That would be somewhat like carb counting wouldn't it. It's hard to get everything with carbs where I live

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:47:03 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
all i can tell you is this....gabi's hba1c's have never been over 6.7 and we dont count

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:47:25 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Sharon...Thanks for the carb count...It would make it much to high for Kaitlyn, She is "allowed" 30 grams...1 starch and 1 milk

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:47:27 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Drew reads labels too Wanda..instead he asks, how much insulin do I need to cover this?:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:47:43 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
One of the best lessons learned in Sweet Kids (IMHO) is that the child should decide how much (s)he wants to eat, and insulin should be given accordingly. When we were on the exchange plan for 6 years, it was NEVER an option.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:48:18 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
they also come sugar free, which have 12 carbs before adding the milk

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:48:19 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Nice to hear so many with a postive experience of carb counting - it definitely paves the way for more precision together with greater freedom - a nice combination.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:48:40 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Wanda, too bad you and Kaitlyn don't live in Michigan. Lawwren would love to have a playmate with diabetes her own age

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:48:43 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Lauraelena, where do you live?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:48:47 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Ellen..If I left it up to Kaitlyn she would NEVER eat..LOL...

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:48:49 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
hey steve :-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:49:08 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
We do read label but anything with sugar is a no no,, and she looks at the amount of carbs in things. Honduras, central america

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:49:22 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Wanda, my son used to LIVE TO EAT when he was on NPH.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:49:29 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Sharon -- carb counting's just a tool - not the only one for sure -- but some people find it helpful and a good match for the way they eat, live

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:49:37 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Barb...LOL...So wouldnt Kaitlyn...Kaitlyn enjoys sending e mails though..Although she cant spell!!!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:50:03 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Lauraelena, you may need to rely heavily on written resourses. Try the Carb Counting booklets at a good start.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:50:12 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
i am not knocking it at all betty. like i said before, we are very lucky that our endo philosophy works for us, thats all

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:51:01 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Since the "eating thing" isn't going so well, We are SERIOUSLY talking about the pump. Kaitlyn has almost agreed to it...LOL

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:51:21 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
The food labeled "sugar free" sometimes has as many carbs as regular....

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:51:24 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Betty B. how does one determine how much extra insulin to give when a child eats something not in the meal plan - for example - an impromptu ice cream cone after school? Assume they can use the B-D MiniPen which allows them to dose by 1/2 units.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:51:26 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Laura when first diagnosed would always be hungry now she controls herself really good. Her highest is usually 170-180, she does do a lot of exercise. I think that helps also.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:51:31 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
It's great to see so many of you are involving the kids so that they start learning counting/foods/insulin from a young age

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:51:43 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Sue, I agree. Those 3 booklets are wonderful. That is what I gave Drew's aide at school.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:52:11 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Would that be a regular ice cream or sugar free

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:52:23 Eastern US
joyce (Liz,16,dx'd,2/00) from 172.143.117.15
sharon, your way sounds great, but how do you know how much insulin to give?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:53:04 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Ellen, the dose depnds on the size and insulin sensitivity of the child. What is Zachary's total daily dose of insulin (all kinds added together)?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:53:21 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Wanda, when my daughter would say "I hate my pump" (she began w/ it in March 00) I would ask her "Do you like it when you don't have to eat when you're not hungry?" Sometimes I felt like all I did was push food on her.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:53:22 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Ellen...You ask the BEST questions!!! How do you think of them!!!! LOL

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:53:26 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Regular ice cream - although even sugar free isn't necessarily carb free.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:53:54 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
Lauralena, be careful with the sugar-free ice cream....can have almost as many carbs as regular....we just buy the regular (and measure it out, of course)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:54:14 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
We can calculate a "best guess" that you can only confirm and fine tune by trying it.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:54:20 Eastern US
Barb (Mom of Lawren, 6 yrs, dx'd at 4) from 63.20.15.124
Goodnight folks, thanks, Betty for your words of wisdom.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:54:23 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Sue..That is how I am feeling now, everytime I turn around it time to feed her...She does want the pump, but afraid of the needle hurting when going in

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:54:40 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
What is worst the sugar in it or the carbs? Might sound a silly question.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:54:42 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
when my kids were first dx'd, the endo put them on a set amount of insulin (diff for each kid) and we titrated slowly form there. gabi was controlled in about 2 weeks, steven is taking a little longer. i think because of many food issues

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:54:57 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Each small scoop of regular ice cream is about 1 carb -- but you may be able to get more exact info from the shop where you get the ice cream

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:55:03 Eastern US
Kathy/Ohio (Tom) from 131.238.90.149
Bye, Barb.....I have to run too....THANKS BETTY!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:55:22 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
The carbs...If it is a high carb count

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:55:59 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Betty, we have the carb thing down pat for this week with Z, on the pump. (Basal is approx 19Units per day, breakfast 1:10, Lunch 1:18, Dinner 1:20, he weighs approx 112 and is 5'4")

I was wondering for parents of kids who don't have the pump, how do they determine what to give so the long acting doesn't interfere with the extra insulin given via pen or injection.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:56:03 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Laurelena, neither the carbs or the sugar are "bad." They just are -- you need to know how much carbohydrate in order to keep food in balance with insulin.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:56:07 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Lauraelena...NO QUESTION IS SILLY!!!!:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:56:10 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Wanda, Emla cream. we call it "magic cream" at our house. It works wonders. Visit Minimed's web site if you haven't already.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:56:35 Eastern US
Steve (Allie - 14 - dx 6/97 pump 12/99) from 168.191.57.220
Betty - that';s what I don't understand - you say a small scoop of regular ice cream is about 1 carb - but if you look at the packaging, it can range from 14-26 CHO/half cup. How do you compensate for that?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:56:37 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Most drive thru restaurants have handy booklets at the window with their nutrition info...I have carb counted many a happy meal:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:57:23 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Sue..I keep telling her that...But what do mothers know???LOL

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:57:30 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Wanda - for more information on EMLA - http://www.emla-usa.com They even have a coloring book about it.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:57:43 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Sugar is one source of carbohydrte but certainly not the only one -- a 300 blood sugar from eating something "healthy" like fruit or brown rice is just as hard on the body as a 300 blood sugar from eating Ding Dongs and ice cream. It's control that matters

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:58:04 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
I vote for EMLA also..

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:58:17 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
OHHH thanks Ellen...That might help!!!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:58:44 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Laura loves to eat at fast food restaurants, of all Burger King makes her level fly high. (fast foods are still popular around here, they are quite new) but others like Wendys, or Churchs doesn't do that. Any idea why

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:58:44 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Betty, is there a formula for deciding insulin amount if the food/carb you are giving is also high fat?

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:58:46 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
I don't know how many of you feel about aspartame and kids, I prefer to limit to soda. (Ok, and pancake syrup) I find that many "non diet" foods to not vary enough for me to use them. ie, I use low sugar jelly (1/2 the carbs and no nutrasweet), soft cones with 1/2 cup of regular icecream usually is only around 18 - 20 grams total carbos.

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:58:53 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Kristy..Does Drew feel it when you put a new site in???

Mon Sep 18 2000 21:59:41 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Steve - the 14 grams kind would be the one carb sort -- probably plain vanilla or chocolate. The ones at the high end of the scale are the ones with candy, fruit, marshmallows and so on mixed in, usually. If you can get the right information for the kind being eaten today, great. Otherwise, you take your best guess, based on similar foods, and then see what you learn from the resulting blood sugars.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:00:00 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Wanda.. he says he doesn't feel it..

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:00:12 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
I'm really so afraid to give her anything with sugar.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:00:37 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Sue CT - I'll go out on a limb and say I feel that Nutrasweet is a poison...even though many would flame me for saying that. I get severe headaches as does my daughter, from the product. My son with the diabetes does not get sick from it, but he no longer consumes it since pumping.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:00:46 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Wanda, it Kaitlin already thinks you "know nothing" - I bet you can't wait till she's a teen and knows EVEN more. At 10, my son already knows tons more that me :-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:00:57 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
i'm with you sue. i only keep the soda & syrup sugar free, and some ices to have as free-snacks, whenever they want

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:01:07 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
The good thing is that the dentist appointment is zero cavity :-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:01:12 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Wow, Ellen, high fat meals are one of the hardest things to manage. Fat slows down the digestion of carb quite a bit.. high fat meals are often the "gift that keeps on giving." Just a larger dose of Humalog with the meal may not get the job done

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:01:14 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Lauraelena...Do your food packages list the carb count???

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:01:28 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Lauralena..Why? I would be more afraid that she would find sweet things so desirable that she would sneak food..thus starting some negative food issues..

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:01:43 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Pumps are great for this as they can give square wave or dual wave boluses thatstretch the meal insulin out over time.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:02:31 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Sue...Of course..Aren't kids just wonderful!!!

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:02:39 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Most of the things we buy come from the states. But for example if she eat an orange her level goes up, am apple does not have the same effect.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:02:43 Eastern US
sharon (2 kids with D) from 165.247.24.178
i am suddenly very sleepy & going to bed. goodnite all & thanks for the chat

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:02:48 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
My goodness ... it's been an hour already Betty.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:02:48 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Hi fat foods - pizza really does my son in. Extra quick acting insulin usually drives him low within a couple of hours, then you feed the low, and when the pizza kicks in during the middle of the night, then he wakes up high. Yikes, I really hate pizza since diagnosis.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:03:04 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Goodnight Sharon.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:03:14 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Betty, I'm really asking the question for parents of children on injections - how do they determine how much extra insulin to give when an impromptu high fat treat is being offered at a time not regularly scheduled for a snack?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:03:23 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
SNAP=sugar is not a poison:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:03:27 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Kristy -- in my experience, kids who are completely forbidden sweets are more likely to develop issues, horde food, and so on. Sweets are not harmful as long as they are part of an overall healthy food intake.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:03:42 Eastern US
Wanda~Mass (Kaitlyn age 6 dx'd 12-23-98 @ age 4) from 24.218.184.227
Well I am gonna run...Thanks for the great chat:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:03:46 Eastern US
Steve (Allie - 14 - dx 6/97 pump 12/99) from 168.191.57.220
chinese food is another challenge - lots of hidden carbs in the sauces

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:03:49 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
We don't have the option of a pump. No support here and no insurance would help out.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:04:25 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Ellen: When Marissa was on injections, we'd mix a little Humalog and Regluar to cover the high-fat snacks.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:04:41 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
What about the sugar free candies??

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:04:58 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Sorry ellen, I never got expert at that. I was always afraid that I'd overdo it and drive him to low in the night. Nighttime lows scare the heck out of me. Past bad experiences with my daughter.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:05:42 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Ellen, It depends on the size of the kid -- you can come up with an estimate by looking at their usual meals and doses. If a child takes 4 units for 4 carb portions (or Starch and Fruit exchanges), they'd need about an extra unit of Humalog to touch up for each carb in the impromptu snack. I don't recommend touching up very heavily with Regular because ithangs aorund too long, perhaps leading to lows later on.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:05:59 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
I'm glad I haven't experienced nighttime lows

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:06:20 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
I agree totally about the food issues, Betty. We have worked hard to not make a big fuss about the whole eating thing..

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:06:26 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
Lauraelena, watch out for sugar free sorbitol candies - can cause lots of gas, bloating, tummy aches etc...especially if the kid over indulges.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:07:00 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Laurelna, read the oabel on the sugar-free candies you use. Most have the same or more carb than a comparable "real" candy and they cost a good deal more -- if they don't have any calories or carbs, only then are they "free"

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:07:06 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Lauraelena, do you have glucagon in your home?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:07:08 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Sue was Evan pumping before inhaling?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:07:55 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
For example, sugar free gummi bears have about 45-60 grams of carb in a small bag (depending on the brand) while a regular hershey bar has 20 grams

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:08:21 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Tummy aches...aha.. She usually eats one or two,she controls that too. She does like sugarfree gum

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:08:39 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
no, I wish he wanted the pump. no interest at this point. I think it is the "attachment" thing. he's kinda low key and i think that he doesn't want to draw attention to his diab.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:08:53 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
This is all new to me. What about the sugar in the hershey bar, does that add up to the carbs?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:10:11 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
yes, all the carbs in the Hershey bar are from sugar --

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:10:32 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
and the carbs in the sugar-free gummi bears are from sugar alcohol

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:10:56 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
and the carbs from bread come from starch -- and they all need insulin to cover them equally

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:11:15 Eastern US
Steve (Allie - 14 - dx 6/97 pump 12/99) from 168.191.57.220
Lauralena - is there a nutritionist in your endocrinologist's practice?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:11:24 Eastern US
Ellen (FL) (Zachary 12, dx 2/89, pump 5 years) from 205.188.208.170
I need to leave. Betty, thank you for all you do to help families with children with diabetes. You are delightful and empowering.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:11:29 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
Lauralena - does your daughter see a nutritionist?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:11:52 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
It's not that you SHOULDN'T eat either sugar OR sugar-free. The point is to know what you're getting so you can match it to the available insulin.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:12:11 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Betty what would you tell a family who was considering putting their child with diabetes on one of the fashionable low carb diets?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:12:30 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
I've got a rice krispies treat, from kellog's here. It says 18g of total carb, 8g sugar is the sugar included in the carbs. How would it affect her if she ate this.??

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:12:41 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
thanks so much Ellen -- I think we're all about ready to call it a night. Thanks so much for coming -- and come back next week when Hope Warshaw will hold forth on Fast Foods!! Night!

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:13:20 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Betty, our scheduled hour has run on a bit longer than planned. I'll leave the room open until 10:30 pm (22:30 on the clock above), and I'll have a full transcript online first thing tomorrow morning.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:13:32 Eastern US
Kristy (Drew 7yrs dx @ 3,pumping 3years) from 199.174.151.101
Thank you Betty...I appreciate your time:-)

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:13:43 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
It's just a little over one carb Laurelena -- as long as she had insulin to cover it, her blood sugar would probably be just fine

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:13:49 Eastern US
Steve (Allie - 14 - dx 6/97 pump 12/99) from 168.191.57.220
betty - before you go - any suggestions on a book - we use the colleen nemtzer (sic) nutrition list - seems to be prety good - do you have any other suggestions

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:13:57 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Thanks Betty for sharing your wisdom with us.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:13:58 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Yes she saw one at the beginning, but all she did was give her a list of what to eat for every meal

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:14:25 Eastern US
Judy from NY (Elissa..age 19..2nd year of college...pumping 15 yrs) from 24.161.8.110
that's not a nutritionist - I don't care WHAT she called herself!

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:14:27 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Thanks, Jeff, It's dinner time here in AZ but others are welcome to stay and chat until 10:30

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:14:54 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Betty, I didn't know how this chat room worked, thank you for your help this is my first time here. I'm from Honduras

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:14:54 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
Lauraelena, here's info from Cheerios and FruitLoops, each a one cup serving
Cheerios; total carbs=22grams, this is 3 from fiber, 1 from sugar and 18 from other
Fruit Loops; total carbs = 28grams; 1 from fiber, 15 from sugar and 12 from other sources.\
Point is, a carb is a carb is a carb. (pretty much) You want to limit sugar only because it is emply calories and the carbs from other sources will contain more nutrition.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:15:03 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Steve, what kind of book are you looking for - a book for counting carbs?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:15:40 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
or on general diabetes nutrition info for kids?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:15:57 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Lauraelena: We have other chat rooms, including a very active Parents room. Click on the "Room" list in the top right to change rooms when you're done here.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:16:18 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Do you mean she can eat other cornflakes and not just the simple one???

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:16:52 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
If it's the former, then I recommend "The Diabetes Carbohydrate and Fat gram Guide, from the ADA, author Lea Ann Holzmeister. available on Amazon

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:17:02 Eastern US
Lauraelena (Mom of Laura 11 dx'd 10) from 207.42.182.70
Yes I've been to the parents and it's also been a great help, my daughter has 'Meet" some friends in the preteens also.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:17:02 Eastern US
Steve (Allie - 14 - dx 6/97 pump 12/99) from 168.191.57.220
yes betty - carb counting - this one seems to have a lot of prepared foods listed as well as raw ingredients - I also refer to the USDA web site which has a lot of good information on raw ingredients and carb count

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:17:19 Eastern US
Sue,CT (Evan10,dx@7,inhaling; Casey5,dx@2,pumping) from 205.188.200.165
I don't know what you mean by other cornflakes and simple ones? do you mean things like frosted cornflakes?

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:17:43 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Laurelena -- thanks so much for coming. I hope you come back again. Buena suerte!

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:18:29 Eastern US
Steve (Allie - 14 - dx 6/97 pump 12/99) from 168.191.57.220
thanks betty

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:19:06 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
If you're stout enough to use the USDA site, then I'd also recommend "Food Values of Portitons Commonly Eaten" by Pennington. It's COMPLETE

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:19:53 Eastern US
BettyB from 205.188.198.51
Night all, I'm signing off now.

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:20:16 Eastern US
Steve (Allie - 14 - dx 6/97 pump 12/99) from 168.191.57.220
you know the problem we have - judging portion sizes on 'real' foods.....for example - when is an apple a standard apple? Which counts include the skin, which don't -

Mon Sep 18 2000 22:22:17 Eastern US
Jeff Hitchcock (Marissa, 13, dx'd 24 months, pump) from 206.112.197.133
Thanks for coming everyone. See you next Monday night.



                 
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